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    Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

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    Federation of Antanares
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    Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Federation of Antanares on Thu Dec 04, 2014 7:58 am

    Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations


    Nation attending to the conference:
    The Socialist Commonwealths of Europe and Asia
    The Social Democracy of New-Zealand
    Landgraviate of Arveyres
    The Constitutional Monarchy of The United Kingdoms of Zackalantis
    The Federal Aristocratic Kingdom of New Tarajan
    Republic of Duresia
    Democratic Republic of Australian Eltebena
    The Federation of Atanosia
    Federated Planitan Republics
    Ienara/Tokugawa


    Host and moderators:
    Kingdom of Aloia
    Federation of Antanares
    United States of Europe

    "Welcome to the open statement for the Conference of Zumbrota about the actual situation of the relationship between the two main alliances of the our time, the SECURS and the UPS. We are here, thanks to our honorable host, Aloia, and we thanks  the Kingdom for this opportunity. We would also to thanks the United State of Europe, for have accepted the difficult role of mediator in this conference with the Kingdom of Aloia. Of course, I would thanks all the countries that have decided to participate to this conference, from the two sides and from the neutral world.
    So, here we are. We hope that the conference, that start in a time of war, will end with the peace. So, I invite on the stage the first of our guest, the representative of Europe and Asia. Thanks for you presence and for your wait and welcome to Zumbrota
    "

    OOC: Please, I ask to everyone, after this post and up to new indications, moderators will intervene to choose the next country for the intervention. After, will start a phase of debate. Thanks and welcome.


    Last edited by Federation of Antanares on Thu Dec 04, 2014 9:53 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Eurasia on Thu Dec 04, 2014 9:23 am


    "I thank my colleague from Antanares for moderating this conference, as well as the representatives from Europe and from Aloia. As all of you are aware, peaceful relations between our organizations have drastically eroded to the point of bloodshed. I am certain that all of us, no matter what organization our nations belong to, sincerely wishes that this could have been avoided. No one here wanted to send their sons and daughters to die far from home in foreign lands, or, conversely, to die in defense of their homeland.

    The outbreak of these hostilities can be traced back to the situation in Tokugawa. Ienaran rebels, fighting in the name of self determination and democracy, sought and seek to create their own nation in Tokugawa. The Union of Progressive States saw a fledgling state, barely alive, attempting to be the democratic voice of Tokugawa. We gave it arms, nurtured it, and helped it fight for its right to exist.

    Being that Tokugawa was a member of the SECURS organization, tensions quickly increased until Tarajani forces, deployed to protect the Tokugawan government, shot down Eurasian aircraft. Very quickly, we retaliated, and smashed a path through the blockade. Quickly, Zach forces fired on our ports without provocation, resulting in an invasion of their nation. As has been reported, I have ordered all Eurasian forces in foreign lands to stop any advances and to defend their current positions in a show of good faith in these negotiations.

    Now, to the real issue at hand: Ienaran sovereignty. The UPS will not support anything less than full independence and sovereignty for Ienara. While a complete republic would be ideal, we will show good faith and compromise to a Constitutional Monarchy is the Ienaran people wish to do so. Further, we request an official apology from the Zackalantis government for firing on our ports unprovoked. Thank you."
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Federation of Antanares on Thu Dec 04, 2014 9:25 am

    "Thanks you for your intervention, delegate of Europe and Asia. We will call now on the stage the delegate of New Tarajan, members of the SECURS, the other side of the question. Please, delegate, make your statement"
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by New Tarajan on Thu Dec 04, 2014 9:52 am


    "Your Excellencies, delegates and Heads of Governments of all the countries, good day.
    First of all, I wish to personally thank all of you for their presence here, today, and particularly our three hosts, Aloia, Europe and Antanares, for their decision of accepting the role of mediators in such a delicate moment.
    As you may know, this Conference is the result of a personal call of mine to all countries involved in the conflict, in order to try to find a possible diplomatic solution ending this war once and for all.
    Thus, no one here can doubt how sincere and strong is the commitment of New Tarajan, which I have the honour to represent as King and Emperor, and of SECURS as a whole, to peace and stability.

    So said, Premier Fortier already reconstructed the main events which led to this Conference.
    What I wish to add, are two clarifications.
    Let us proceed in order:

    1) Why New Tarajan intervened in the Tokugawan conflict? First of all, and Premier Fortier already recalled it, we have a number of treaties and alliance with Tokugawa. Moreover, they are a member of SECURS.
    However, alongside the neverending commitment of New Tarajan to side with its allies when in danger, there's also another reason because I personally ordered the intervention of our forces, under authorization of the Tokugawan government: Ienara is a secessionist regime.
    As such, no matter how many countries recognize it, the first (and, in truth, only) think they would need to become a legitimate government, is the recognition of the country from which they were seceding. Thus, it was completely natural, and right, to consider Ienara as no more than a rebel movement. As such, the decision of the UPS to send money and weapons to the Ienarans was no more than a blatant intrusion in the domestic issues of a sovereign country.
    And New Tarajan never tolerated such a kind of intrusions: every country has a right to its own sovereignty. Mr. Fortier pointed out that Ienara was fighting for its own self-determination; what I am keen to question here is: why not resolving the issue between Ienara and Tokugawa alone? If the UPS was so moved by the view of people fighting for what they believed to be a good cause, why not attempting a diplomatic solution? Why not approaching Tokugawa and working with them to find a peaceful solution? Why not even calling for our mediation, as allies of Tokugawa?
    None of this happened. What we saw, was a group of countries organizing supplies to a rebel movement, without even questioning about the legitimacy of their act, trying to impose a determined political regime, not even asking themselves if that regime was really what the Tokugawan people wanted.
    In front of such a fact, New Tarajan could not have done anything but intervene, under authorization of the legitimate Tokugawan government.
    We sent our warnings, informed every country which could have been involved not to violate the blockade. But in vain.
    And, then, war erupted.
    Now, what is done, is done. But we shall not forget, Your Excellencies, that what we need to avoid first and foremost is that kind of arrogance by which we may believe that our political regime, and only it, is the right form of political organization.
    New Tarajan and SECURS never pretended to impose monarchy to any country. Why UPS tried to do the same? Why are they asking right now this same thing?
    Our proposal about this point is simple: let Tokugawan and Ienaran decide, without any kind of pressure, no matter what the result will be. Of course, all of this should happen in a civilized manner.

    2) The issue of Zackalantis attack. I believe that this issue could be better addressed by the representative of the UKZ itself.
    But I hope they will not feel themselves uncomfortable, if, as a friend of their people, I will launch a card in their favour.
    Zackalantis never made an unprovoked attack. Why? The answer is very simple: because they are bound to the SECURS Charter. And this Charter explicitly provide for collective security in case one of its Members is attacked, no matter the reason of the attack itself.
    Now, our fleet was attacked. Thus, Zackalantis automatically get involved.
    Maybe we could question the targets of their attacks, or similar. But sure we could not blame a country for having decided to aid an ally, strictly respecting its duties.
    And, for their decision, they have also faced an invasion directly on their homeland.
    Honestly, I do not see any reason for any kind of apology about this; but, as I said, I will leave such an issue to our Zack friends.

    Thank you."
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Federation of Antanares on Thu Dec 04, 2014 9:57 am

    "We thanks the King of New Tarajan for his presence at the table of the conference. Now, I think, after listen the two main sides involved in the question, that we can start with the first problem: what must be the future of Tokugawa, or Ienara. I think we have here two delegate that would represent Ienara and Tokugawa. I think, before start with the debate about the situation in Tokugawa, we must listen their point. I invite, firstly, the delegate of Ienara to talk. Thanks"
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Federation of Antanares on Thu Dec 04, 2014 8:40 pm

    "We thanks the representative of Ienara for his speech. I think we are here not to force the people of Ienara to take this or that choice, but to grantee, firstly to them, the right to do their choice. If the choice of the people of Ienara, former Tokugawa, it is to be reunited under the flag of Ienara, who are us to decide against?
    Of course, I think everyone would have some certainties. For example, I hope the government will grantee the immunity to all the soldiers that have fought on the side of the past government and will not follow discriminatory politics about the supporter of the monarchy or of the oppositions.
    Of course, if this is the decision of the people of Ienara, I think the forces of the UPS and the SECURS, less then a treaty, must abandon the area of the People's Republic right now and that the conference can continue with another topics. Everyone, please, express eventually your position"
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Federation of Antanares on Thu Dec 04, 2014 9:50 pm

    "With this conditions, of course Antanares will recognize the People's Republic of Ienara and of course would send, in the next hours, a first wave of aids, under the form of goods, medicines, engineers and other specialists. But, still this is the line guide of Antanares, I would propose to all the nations that attend here to express their positions about Ienara. Thanks"
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Australian Eltebena on Thu Dec 04, 2014 11:06 pm

    "The States of the Democratic Republic of Australian Eltebena and it's Territories will recognise the People's Republic of Ienara. The AusHumanity Organisation will fly in supplies and send 40 humanitarian soldiers to help rebuild the affected areas. Our nation will also provide a modest monetary contribution of $25 million AUDs to assist. I would also like to personally thank the hosts and moderators of this conference; Aloia, Antanares and Europe."


    Last edited by Australian Eltebena on Thu Dec 04, 2014 11:07 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Typo)
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Zackalantis on Thu Dec 04, 2014 11:56 pm

    Prime Minister Reginald Potter

    I would like to thank the governemnt of Aloia for hosting this conference and to Antanares and USE for extednding their services as moderators of this conference. I am glad to represent His Majesty's United Kingdoms and His Commonwealth. His Majesty sends his greetings and good wishes to all delegates and heads of states present here for a fruitful and conclusive conference aimed towards deescalation of tensions and establishment of peace. Also we would like to thank the Tarajani monarch for his efforts in the establishment of this conference

    The UKZ would like to make its stance clear on several issues, the legality of Zach attack on Eurasia and Ireland, The War with Atanosia, The legitamacy of Ienara and Tokugawa, and the future of the Zach overseas Commonwealth Territory of Zach Mihara.
    Firstly, The attack of Eurasia and Ireland wasn't unprovoked. This can be justified firstly by examining the SECURS charter, and by examining the bi-lateral agreement between UKZ and New Tarajan. Secondly, Zach sources aboard the vessels which opened fire were informed that Eurasia had begun incursions into the Zach Commonwealth realm. Therefore in retalition they fired upon Eurasian coasts. In the case of Ireland, The Irish governemnt declared that all economic ties with New Tarajan and UKZ have been terminated as they were at war with NT and UKZ. Following this the zach naval ships stationed to conduct scientific resarch on the siesmic activity in the region opened fire on Irish coasts. Regarding the choice of target. The Zach naval ships fired at predominantly naval ports and bases. Loss of any civilian life is highly regretted.
    That being said the UKZ regrets all the events that unfolded out, from the zach involvement in the war to the UPS nations funding rebels and bringing woe and destruction to civllian life.

    Secondly, The war with atanosia has gone on for too long and the Atanosian governemnt i showing signs of ending the cease fire. We request all nations present here to take measures to prevent the same.

    Thirdly, the issue of Tokugawa and Inera. As of this moment the zach commonwealth does not recognise Inera. But if the Ineran people establish a contitutional monarchy the zach government might bear scope to regonise Inera. The UKZ is ready to work with Ienera and Tokugawa to write and establish a nwe constitution which protects the rights of the people, the Shogun and the Tokugawans supporting the Royalist rule. As long as inera promises respect for zach commonwealth territorial integirty and respect for life, property and integirty of the Royal family of Tokugawa.
    UKZ would be happy to welcome another nation in the ranks of Consitutional Monarchy.

    and lastly, The future of Zach Mihara. Zach mihara is the over-seas commonwealth territory of the UKZ. And we wish to keep it that way. Therefore we request the Tokugawan/Ieneran governemnt to respect the sovreignity of the zach commonwealth realm. Zach Mihara can work in collaboration with the governemnt formed under the new constitution.  

    With this i would like to conclude the statement on behalf of His Majesty and his subjects.
    Thank You
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Eurasia on Fri Dec 05, 2014 2:07 am

    "The representative from Zackalantis' statement contains several inaccuracies. Eurasia did not invade Zackalantis until after we were unjustly attacked. Whatever those sailors heard is not our concern. If they were given false information, which seems probable, then Zackalantis is clearly at fault. Further, we were fired on first by the Tarajani ships who shot down our planes. All actions undertaken by the UPS during the war were retaliatory in nature. We never acted as the agressor. At least, Eurasia didn't.

    However, we are more concerned with the issue of, as my colleague from Zackalantis pointed out, the issue of Mihara. Will it retain its sovereignty under foreign powers or be re-nationalized by the Ienaran government?"
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Zackalantis on Fri Dec 05, 2014 2:20 am

    UKZ has withdrawn all declarations of war against all UPS nations except Atanosia. We are ready to help in the reconstruction and rehabilitation of ports destroyed in Eurasia.
    Discussing who started the war is just going to make tensions go sky high and some nations may not like or agree with claims made by different nations. This is not what we require. We need to establish trust and confidence through Confidence Building Measures (CBM) therefore lets forget this discussion.

    About Zach Mihara, we certainly hope that it remains in the real of tge zach Commonwealth. We will find it very difficult to come to any other agreement or arrangement.
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by New Atanea on Fri Dec 05, 2014 3:02 am

    The invasion led by Atanosia into Zackalantis was organized by victims of naval attacks by UKZ as a counter measure. It is technically not a war between Atanosia and Zackalantis but UPS and Zackalantis. Those actions were done as a gesture of retaliation and protection of our interests as an organization.
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Zackalantis on Fri Dec 05, 2014 3:13 am

    certainly. But Ireland has withdrawn from the war. We have withdrawn declarations of war against EA and I'm sure our two nations can come to a compromise as well.
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by New Tarajan on Fri Dec 05, 2014 3:18 am

    "I wish to correct the Atanosian delegate, the war was between UPS and SECURS. Zackalantis is not alone, and it will never be so (also considering how faithfully their respected their obligations toward the alliance).

    We deeply thank the Ienaran representative for presenting us the choice of the people of Ienara.
    New Tarajan will officially recognize Ienara as sovereign country, re-establish (and, if you wish so, improving) the ties we already had with Tokugawa.
    Our financial sector needs to come back into full activity, and we don't see a better occasion for this than the efforts to rebuild your country infrastructures and economy. Thus, we are ready to provide you direct investments, technical and medical assistance, military training (we already had a similar agreement with Tokugawa) and other similar deals."


    OOC: Since my brother (Antanares) is the only active moderator of the Conference at the moment, I suggest everyone to wait he will come back home (he's now at the university) to resume the debate (or waiting for other moderators; by the way, resuming the order we established at the beginning). Otherwise, we risk to create confusion.
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by New Tarajan on Fri Dec 05, 2014 3:52 am

    OOC: I meant, that the Moderators decide who shall speak at that moment.
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Federation of Antanares on Fri Dec 05, 2014 4:27 am

    "So, thanks to everyone for their intervention in the question. I think we have reached a common point on the question of Ienara and Tokugawa. Before go ahead with the other questions of the Conference, I will ask to the representative of Ienara to express the position of the new government about the international districts that some nations have in the territory of Tokugawa. Do the districts will remain in the hands of the foreign nations or will be nationalized?"

    OOC: Don't worry to everyone. Please, for the good form of this topic, for all the OOC questions use the other one, thanks.
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    European Mediation

    Post by United States of Europe on Fri Dec 05, 2014 6:16 am

    "First of all,we thank all the nations present here. The mere fact that the weapons have been lowered,and that diplomatic dialogue is preferred,tells us a lot about the willingness of countries to reach an agreement,a compromise,and to end this useless war. We are also honored to serve as the neutral moderator,a sign that Europe is appreciated by the entire international community. Therefore,we analyzed the discussion until now in place,and worked some possible mediation strategies. We have also considered functional in this the spin-off of the issue of Ienara from the invasion of Zackalantis.




    Regarding Ienara,we developed a plan based on various steps,focused on the will of the people of this nation,which should be guaranteed the right to self-determination.
    1] - The first step is for a purely diplomatic and international sphere. All countries present here,to reach a lasting solution,should officially recognize the new government of Ienara as a member of the regional community in all respects (and thus with the relative rights and duties). The government of Ienara will then be free to self-determine whether by its foreign policy. The countries that still maintain troops on the territory of the nation in question,in our view,should withdraw them,but of course the final decision on this will be up to Ienara government itself.
    2] - The second step concerns the domestic policy. It will be only and only the people of Ienara,through democratic rights, to decide which form of government give to the country,what powers leave to the old monarchy,and how to reform the Constitution and the internal institutions. In this context,if necessary also with the support of regional organizations,the international community should support the restructuring and stabilization of the administrative structure of Ienara,through targeted actions of State-Building.
    3] - The third step is purely economic. We believe that the entire international community, through targeted investments, technical support, financial and logistical support, should aim to rebuild the infrastructure and the productive sector of Ienara. In this context it is necessary to engage not only public actors (governments and public companies), but also private actors,provided driven by the interests listed above. Restore prosperity in Ienara is a must. Obviously it will be the legitimate government of Ienara to supervise and manage such operations of investment of the international community.




    Regarding the issue of invasion of Zackalantis,it becomes more complex. We have observed and analyzed what was said by the representatives of various countries,and,being in a position of strict neutrality,it is virtually impossible to determine who is wrong and who is right. For reasons of self-determination of the people and human rights,as mentioned by Eurasia,the intervention by the UPS in Ienara would be justifiable. However, lso the defense by the SECURS of the interests of the local monarchy is legitimated,as the relations between the countries of this organization are governed by specific treaties. The attack against Eurasian port facilities,viewed from the standpoint of the rules contained in the treaties mentioned above, would be,in a way,justified. However the subsequent invasion of Zackalantis is nothing but the obvious response to a declaration of war. A huge escalation in sum,that,said frankly,could also be avoided easily.

    Therefore, given the complexity of the problem, we first of all that all the countries involved to put aside the various national individualism and hate each other, and to do their utmost to achieve a peaceful and lasting solution. Meanwhile, we give a starting point for the development of a shared resolution:
    1] - For relations between SECURS and UPS,we believe it is necessary to develop a treaty which ensures a constant dialogue between the two organizations,which fix the exact respective areas of influence,which should not be violated in any way,and that sanctions the obligation of the peaceful resolution of future disputes. This,if desired,could set the stage for economic,military and diplomatic cooperation agreements,on a bilateral and multilateral level,increasing the degree of integration between the countries,and thus decreasing the risk of conflict.
    2] - So,we must cancel all declarations of war still pending, and demobilize all troops still active in the conflict. Each country,to ensure stability, should be back within the original borders.
    3] - Then,in the specific case of countries Zackalantis and UPS,we believe the right to proceed in this way. First,demobilization of troops and cancellation of declarations of war,restoring the status quo ante-war. So,a kind of joint "declaration of peace",in order to end any conflict in a formal way. Finally,the creation of a joint mechanism for mutual investment for the complete reconstruction and economic recovery,after the ravages of war.

    This is our initial exit strategy now we would like that the various countries in question discuss it in full."
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by New Atanea on Fri Dec 05, 2014 6:22 am

    The invading forces will withdraw back to the capital and their homelands (concerning reinforcements from Talanzaar, Eurasia and Ireland) if these talks achieve their goal of establishing peace between SECURS and UPS, as well as respecting the interests of the Ienaran people and set up a constitutional monarchy in replacement to the Tokugawan dictatorship in correspondance to their request.
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Vajorr on Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:26 am

    I would like to thank the government of Aloia for hosting this vital conference and to extend my gratitude to the governments of Antanares and USE for servicing as moderators for conference. As President of the Republics, the Federal Government extends its welcome to all delegates present as we work for a peaceful solution.

    The Federated Planitan Republics will officially recognize the People’s Republic of Ienara as a sovereign nation and all claims regarding to its validity has been confirmed. The National Assembly has approved an aid package for your nation consisting of medical supplies, food, power generators etc. as we send the citizens we evacuated back to their homes.  We will also donate 35 million Notes for your nations treasury.

    However we would like clarification on the subject of who committed the act first aggression between Zackalantis and UPS.
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Eurasia on Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:00 am

    "The UPS forces were technically fired upon first. Tarajani forces fired upon our airplanes who were delivering aid and supplies to the Ienaran rebels. While Tokugawa had treaties with SECURS, we were still fired on first. Everything after that was retaliatory. Further, we remind the Tarajani delegate that Tokugawan statehood, at the time, was a matter of debate.

    The Senate will soon approve an aid package to the Ienaran state to ensure that it can repair the damage the war caused to its people. We reiterate our commitment to the democratic process in Ienara."
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by New Tarajan on Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:37 am

    "Your Excellency, Tokugawan statehood was a matter of debate only for you, surely not for us. We warned that a violation would have seen our retaliation, and we were authorized to proceed as we have done.
    So, yes we shot first, but only after many warnings, and in response to a violation. That's all.

    About the European proposal: we are ready to accept many of its points, particularly the removal of all declarations of war. We also would be glad to agree to the establishment of some sort of link between SECURS and UPS. We were already working on the possibility of a red-line between us, in order to ease tensions before they escalate in conflict.

    But we wish also to move one step further: we wish to propose to everyone sitting here the establishment of a new world governance system, which will create a new framework for diplomatic initiatives, and which will allow all countries to better interact with each other, to create a new ground for the progress of International Law."
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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Eurasia on Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:11 am

    "I object to that. You are using this peace conference, which we joined in good faith, to promote your own agenda for the supranational government. If you are going to use this conference for your own gain then the UPS sees no further reason to negotiate. We urge you to stop this at once. We should focus on the causes of the war first. You can propose your agenda to the Esamir Parliament when they reconvene after the recess."

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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

    Post by Federation of Antanares on Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:39 am

    "I support the position of Europe and Asia. How mediator, I will confirm that, in this case, will not find space the negotiation for a new international government. We must give the priority to the relationship between UPS-SECURS and to the consequence of the conflict.
    So, while we wait for the response of government of Ienara about the international district constructed from Tokugawa, I think we've reached an important point of the conference: the invasion of Zackalantis. Please, now, Europe and Asia, in the details, explain the all the motivations of the UPS for the invasion. Thanks"

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    Re: Conference of Zumbrota on SECURS-UPS Relations

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